Your Personal Game Theories

[Watzup7856]

I've been playing the original Smash Bros. recently on my Nintendo 64, and while playing i'm thinking about each characters inclusion. by far the weirdest and most out of place inclusion had to be Ness'. so i'm wondering why a character from an out of place game was in this. well the theory goes like this:

After researching Smash Bros one day, i found out that the original Smash Bros. was intended to be a Japan only game (that's a scary thought). Back in 1999, when Smash Bros. came out, Mother 3 was being developed for the Nintendo 64DD, an add on for the Nintendo 64 which was an ultimate flop, and thus Mother 3 was scrapped (but then later replanned for the GBA). Before Mother 3 was scrapped, I believe Ness was supposed to be a promotional for Mother 3 by being in Smash Bros. It makes sense because the Mother series was really popular in Japan, and plus with a new game coming out, it would only make sense to put in the latest protagonist of the series to promote it (which also might explain why Ness was chosen and not Ninten). His inclusion seems weird in America, but from Japan's perspective, it makes sense, well at least to me it does.

so what game theories do you guys have that you think is good enough to share?

[squidgy617]

Honestly Ness' inclusion is as simple as the fact that Earthbound was popular in Japan, where the game is made. Your theory may have been additional reasoning, but I think its mostly just because he was popular.

ANYWAY Zelda. So most of what we know about the timeline is solid fact, but nobody can explain how the Downfall timeline came to be.

Well, my theory is that the Zelda timeline starts as the Downfall one. Essentially, everything is normal. Universe is created, games happen, bla bla bla. Then, in OoT, Link LOSES to Ganon, Ganon gets the whole Triforce, and bam, the Downfall timeline comes into existence.

Link to the Past happens. Link defeats Ganon and gets the Triforce. Then he "wishes all of Ganon's evil to be undone".

What does this mean? ALL of Ganon's evil is undone. This in turn leads to the creation of a new timeline where Ganon's evil was undone and he never defeated Link, and so the Child and Adult timelines are born.

I'm sure I could find a more in depth version of this theory somewhere but thats all I got right now.

[Sir Lemon]

*Hissss!* Zelda Timeline! Burn it! Burn it with fire!

My theory is that the timeline was made to keep the fans happy, who kept trying to connect all the dots from each game to the next. Honestly, in my opinion (I'm not saying this out of any lack of respect) I believe only the games that are directly related to one another (such as Ocarina and Majora) have any kind of connected story to them. They'd often revisit themes in the Zelda games, that was common enough and that included locations such as Lake Hylia and the Gerudo desert and familiar characters returning despite the 100 year or so gap.

I would hear nothing about the timeline until Wind Waker came out, going all Water World on everybody. That got people wondering, I think. It was a really good idea, the previous descendant of the line failing (or not showing up, rather) and us players getting a chance to see what happens when evil wins for once. We saw how much Hyrule changed and I think that got players asking questions.

Recurring themes, familiar locations/characters and new twists on a timeless tale. Zelda is just the same story over and over again yet they make it new and great somehow. I'm sorry, when I bust out my copy of Link to the Past or Ocarina of Time...I'm not thinking about any of that. I don't want to play LttP thinking; oh...this only happens if the Link from OoT dies. I miss the days when the games all had their own isolated canon and nobody cared about timeline carp.

So in my head canon, there is no canon. :P

Then again, even real-world mythology is abound with theories of when and where the stories happened. In summary (TL;DR), I guess all I'm saying is I think the timeline was made for kicks.

*kicks the timeline*

[Ivory]

Except, some of the games had continuity to begin with. Link's Awakening was the sequel to ALttP. OoT and Majora's Mask are directly connected BY TIMELINE CHANGES. Oracle of Ages/Seasons are connected. Wind Waker, Phantom Hourglass and Spirit Tracks are all directly connected.

Point is, you are fooling yourself if you want to deny a timeline with multiple routes exist.

[Sir Lemon]

..but the timeline is trying to connect ALL of those things together. Even then, it has to go into alternate continuities where one thing happens differently and another timeline is spawned. It's neat, I guess... but I don't think I'm "fooling myself" because I prefer thinking of the games as individual installments.

Timeline changes? Majora's Mask? Zelda sends Link back in time and he goes looking for Navi and while searching for her ends up in Termina. How is this a timeline change, though? As far as I know, it's still the same Link, not an alternate one.

[Ivory]

...he goes back in time, thus leaving a future where there is no Link.

[Kapus]

The only issue I have with the Zelda timeline is the separate branch where Gannondorf defeats Link in OOT. It seems very odd to me. By that logic, shouldn't all the games have separate branches where Link is defeated or something?

[Dr. Freeman]

They might all have branches like that, but those branches just don't happen to lead into other Zelda games =O

[Sir Lemon]

Time is pretty static in the Zelda series though. How many times in Ocarina do you jump back and forth between being an adult and a child, memories intact, even to the point of changing the future by going to the past? It's that game's version of Light World/Dark World and I don't think it was meant to be taken that seriously.

If so...then there are THOUSANDS of new timelines. What about the timeline where Link doesn't plant all the magic beans? :P

So, there's a future with no Link. Does that mean Ganondorf is free to rule in this alternate timeline instead of being banished away? I'm guessing that's how they explain Wind Waker, right? Dude, he was sealed away like before. He can't return until the next 100 years or whatever. At that moment, there'd be another one of Link's descendants waiting for him. Regardless of timeline.

Or in the case of Wind Waker. Not. That would have had to have been a failure of a Link between Ocarina/Majora and Wind Waker, assuming the games are tied and that Wind Waker's events are next in the sequence. 100 Years of Darkness, do not pass go, do not collect 200 rupees.

It also doesn't seem too wise of Zelda to send Link back just so Ganondorf could go cause havoc again. She must have had some confidence he wouldn't be back for at least a little while.

Also, this is fun, I haven't geeked out in a while :P

edit: Yeah! Branches!

[Jman]

there is a theory that the Regi trio and Regigigas from Pokemon is inspired by Reggie Fils-Aime (aka the face of Nintendo of America)

[LlamaHombre]

That might be funny if it made sense. Ruby and Sapphire came out in April of 2003 in America, roughly 8 months before Reggie Fils-Aime would even enter Nintendo of America.

[squidgy617]

Time is pretty static in the Zelda series though. How many times in Ocarina do you jump back and forth between being an adult and a child, memories intact, even to the point of changing the future by going to the past? It's that game's version of Light World/Dark World and I don't think it was meant to be taken that seriously.

If so...then there are THOUSANDS of new timelines. What about the timeline where Link doesn't plant all the magic beans? :P

So, there's a future with no Link. Does that mean Ganondorf is free to rule in this alternate timeline instead of being banished away? I'm guessing that's how they explain Wind Waker, right? Dude, he was sealed away like before. He can't return until the next 100 years or whatever. At that moment, there'd be another one of Link's descendants waiting for him. Regardless of timeline.

Or in the case of Wind Waker. Not. That would have had to have been a failure of a Link between Ocarina/Majora and Wind Waker, assuming the games are tied and that Wind Waker's events are next in the sequence. 100 Years of Darkness, do not pass go, do not collect 200 rupees.

It also doesn't seem too wise of Zelda to send Link back just so Ganondorf could go cause havoc again. She must have had some confidence he wouldn't be back for at least a little while.

Also, this is fun, I haven't geeked out in a while :P

edit: Yeah! Branches!

Wrong, wrong, wrong.

I used to think this as well, but then I started posting on Zelda Universe and I got a serious new look at things.

Basically, in all of the situations where Link changes the future, he RETURNS to the future to see those changes, whereas at the end of OoT, he returns to childhood forever. This is what creates the split. Because Link does not go back to the future, the changes he made are not applied to the future, creating two separate timelines.

ALSO for reference: Nintendo's OFFICIAL timeline:

(click to show/hide)

Except, some of the games had continuity to begin with. Link's Awakening was the sequel to ALttP. OoT and Majora's Mask are directly connected BY TIMELINE CHANGES. Oracle of Ages/Seasons are connected. Wind Waker, Phantom Hourglass and Spirit Tracks are all directly connected.

Point is, you are fooling yourself if you want to deny a timeline with multiple routes exist.

This basically.

Plus Miyamoto did state that he had an official timeline LOOOOONG before the Hyrule Historia came out, and he just didn't intend to release it.

[DarkAura]

I think we already have a place to discuss the Zelda "timeline," but whatever.

Speaking of the Wind Fish, it kinda ties in with my recently formulated theory of the Subcons from the Mario games. Since Subcon was said to have been a manifestation of the entirety of the Mushroom Kingdom's subconscious, I believe that the Subcons (i.e. Birdo, Shy Guy) are a physical body of a person's sunconscious or dream, like how Koholint Island came to be.

Or Shy-Guys could be a rouge, tribal-version of the common Toad and since Yoshi Eggs appeared in Subcon once before, Birdo could be a real-world cousin of the Yoshi family.

[BiscuitSlash]

I have a little mini theory that in the Legend Of Zelda games, most normal characters that aren't Link would only have 1 heart of health. Normal people probably couldn't take even half the damage that Link takes minimally. You probably couldn't withstand more than one solid hit from one of those swords that the Stalfos have in OoT. The reason Link starts with 3 and is more durable is probably because he is usually the chosen one or something (doesn't work in all cases such as Wind Waker). Either that or it's simply down to gameplay and story segregation.

[DarkAura]

Partners in Time storyline theory.

Spoilered because spoilers derp.

(click to show/hide)

In the game's prologue, it said that the Shroobs invaded the Mushroom Kingdom, attacked everyone in the past, and forced the infant-version of the protagonists out of the castle. This was all way before E. Gadd invented the time machine that took Princess Peach and two of the Toad assistances back to the very time the Shroob Invasion began. Back in time, Princess Peach used the Cobalt Star (the source of power used for the time machine) to seal away the Elder Princess Shroob then she, and the Toad assistants, were captured by the Princess Shroob's sister. The time machine returned to the present, badly damaged, due to the curiosity of the Junior Shrooboid (the game's first second boss) This was when the titular characters and the others learned about the Shroobs. Then begins the main game.


Now, as for the theory:

My theory is that since the Shroob Invasion happened in the past a major event had to happen in which either the protagonists or the Shroobs lost. If the Shroobs won, than Mario Luigi, Princess Peach, Bowser, Toadsworth, and more than half of the entire Toad population (due to harvesting their Vim for the Swiggler to power the Shroob's UFOs) wouldn't exist in the present...as they are portrayed now. So, since the previously mentioned characters are still alive, a heroic event happened that the Shroobs lost to in the time between the start of the Shroob Invasion in the past and before E. Gadd's time machine was utilized in the present to get to said past. As to what the event was, no one knows. When Princess Peach entered into the past, it created a sort of...I shouldn't say "paradox," when she was brought into the middle of the invasion. The present isn't affected by this due to the Bros' destiny to go back in time and stop the Shroob Invasion themselves and rescue the captives. So, to put it simply, my theory is that none of the events portrayed in Partners in Time wouldn't have happened if Princess Peach, or anyone in the room at the time, didn't use the time machine. The only thing about the game that puzzles me is that if the events in the past happened, and if it was before Princess Peach went back in time, why didn't anyone have a memory of the Shroob Invasion if they somehow survived it and won the battle against the Shrooms?