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Gaming => Mega Man Discussion => Topic started by: PressStart on August 09, 2012, 07:12:09 AM

Title: New 8-bit Sprites on 25th Anniversary Albums??
Post by: PressStart on August 09, 2012, 07:12:09 AM
Speculation time!!

http://www.rockmancorner.com/2012/08/25 ... racks.html (http://www.rockmancorner.com/2012/08/25th-anniversary-technorock-soundtracks.html)

The album covers on the 25th Anniversary Techno/Rock Arrange Soundtracks show off some new sprite-work for classic Robot Masters. What I'm wondering is, where did these come from? While it is entirely possible (and likely) they were just thrown together for the sole purpose of covering this album, there's a few oddities about them:

-Almost all of the Robot Masters shown are given a unique "hurt" sprite, which are similar to the poses seen in Power Battle/Fighters but different from the ones in the Neo Geo Pocket game and definitely not from the original NES titles
-There's weird little differences with some of the sprites, such as Snake Man's tail being shortened
-No jumping or walking sprites are used, only poses, attacking, and being hurt (even to the point of a unique "Snake Man shooting on the ground" sprite being used)

I wanted to try and "rip" some of these, but even the high quality images are not enough, yet. I did try to draw over Snake Man's standing and hurt poses though:
(http://img27.imageshack.us/img27/1025/gwuat.png)
The top left is just the black color of Snake Man's original sprite. The top right is my redraw of what's on the album. The bottom right is my redraw of the hurt pose, and the bottom left is my guess at the hurt sprite being colored to match the other NES sprites.

Originally, I had hoped that these sprites were maybe from some kind of in-progress or canned 8-bit version of the Power Battles, but the limited-poses and repeated states almost makes it seems like they're from some kind of cell-phone title instead (like a puzzle game, where each character would have attack animations for completing a line and a hurt animation for receiving garbage). The only reason I speculate they're from something else is because it'd be strange to create so many new "hurt" sprites for these Robot Masters, when they could have just used other poses.

IN ANY CASE, I hope there's some even higher-res pics in the future of the cover, cuz I do think some of the unique hurt sprites are cool.
Title: Re: New 8-bit Sprites on 25th Anniversary Albums??
Post by: Kapus on August 09, 2012, 07:23:27 AM
Wow. This is pretty weird.

Maybe they're just weird sprite edits they threw in there for the heck of it.
Title: Re: New 8-bit Sprites on 25th Anniversary Albums??
Post by: MusashiAA on August 09, 2012, 07:35:51 AM
YEAH, I NOTICED IT TOO

HOLY SHIT, LOOK AT ALL THOSE HURT POSES!

Rock album cover, some new poses! (http://www.gamer.ne.jp/img/news/20120809/00101de46dd45758330764814a65bf15c755/o/1.jpg)
Techno album cover, full of new poses! (http://www.gamer.ne.jp/img/news/20120809/00101de46dd45758330764814a65bf15c755/o/2.jpg)

EDIT: Almost all of those RMs have new dot art for hurt poses! Nice detail!

Airman has one AND a different firing pose
Heatman has one
Elecman has one
Woodman probably has one but it's out of picture
Metalman has one
Crashman has one
Bubbleman has one
HARDMAN HAS A CRAMPIER DESIGN, ALSO HAS A HURT POSE
Snake has one too AND a new standing frame
Pharaoh has one
Skull has one (I lol'd)
Flashman has one
QUICKMAN HAS A DIFFERENT DESIGN (more athletic), also has a hurt pose
Title: Re: New 8-bit Sprites on 25th Anniversary Albums??
Post by: PressStart on August 09, 2012, 08:25:22 AM
Quote from: "Kapus"
Wow. This is pretty weird.

Maybe they're just weird sprite edits they threw in there for the heck of it.
Lol, as much as I wish and hope for some weird new game, this is probably the truth.
(http://img266.imageshack.us/img266/1313/spritesm.png)
Grouped em cuz hey, why not.
Title: Re: New 8-bit Sprites on 25th Anniversary Albums??
Post by: Kapus on August 09, 2012, 08:29:02 AM
Skull Man, Pharaoh Man and Hard Man have the best hurt poses.
Title: Re: New 8-bit Sprites on 25th Anniversary Albums??
Post by: Geno on August 09, 2012, 07:18:10 PM
I'm gonna challenge myself and see if I can remake these.
Hey, when I do, I could post them, and someone could replace the MM8BDM ones with these ones!
Someone should find a higher quality version of the rock album cover.
Title: Re: New 8-bit Sprites on 25th Anniversary Albums??
Post by: MusashiAA on August 09, 2012, 08:01:55 PM
Quote from: "geno"
I'm gonna challenge myself and see if I can remake these.
Hey, when I do, I could post them, and someone could replace the MM8BDM ones with these ones!

Skin replacement mod, yes please

Or just add those into the vanilla game as alternate skins
Title: Re: New 8-bit Sprites on 25th Anniversary Albums??
Post by: Geno on August 09, 2012, 08:05:51 PM
Here's "set 1" of the new poses!
(http://cutstuff.net/molly/DBBKUP/owies%20set1.png)

And it doesn't look much like Hardman's smaller, it looks like they just shortened the legs and arms.
AND since I couldn't figure out that the heck was going on with Quickman's face, I just put a modified normal Quickman head over it.
Also includes PressStart's Snakeman.

EDIT: "Set 2"
(http://cutstuff.net/molly/DBBKUP/owies%20set2.png)
Title: Re: New 8-bit Sprites on 25th Anniversary Albums??
Post by: PressStart on August 09, 2012, 08:41:46 PM
Haha yesss, awesome! The spit flying from Flash Man is great.

Excellent job : )
Title: Re: New 8-bit Sprites on 25th Anniversary Albums??
Post by: GameAndWatcher on August 09, 2012, 08:50:40 PM
QuickMan's mouth should be more open.
Title: Re: New 8-bit Sprites on 25th Anniversary Albums??
Post by: Geno on August 09, 2012, 08:57:03 PM
I won't be able to continue until someone finds a better quality version of the Rock arrange album.
Title: Re: New 8-bit Sprites on 25th Anniversary Albums??
Post by: PressStart on August 09, 2012, 09:04:51 PM
Yeah; even though the images are pretty big, it is still hard to see all of the pixels, and some end up getting squished or hidden. As soon as they're released, some high-res photos should make the job easier (although they'll still be in weird black-and-white)

I love the re-sprites you've done, though!
Title: Re: New 8-bit Sprites on 25th Anniversary Albums??
Post by: Geno on August 09, 2012, 09:39:18 PM
I will not do the sprites on the rock arrange album until a better picture surfaces.
Though I'm sure somebody can put the other sprites to good use.
Title: Re: New 8-bit Sprites on 25th Anniversary Albums??
Post by: MusashiAA on August 10, 2012, 01:53:20 AM
GENO DOOOOOOOOD

LOOK

YOU DID IT (http://www.rockmancorner.com/2012/08/a-closer-look-at-25th-anniversary.html#more)
Title: Re: New 8-bit Sprites on 25th Anniversary Albums??
Post by: PressStart on August 10, 2012, 04:00:46 AM
I'm glad it got posted, cuz the commentors on the blog post are now pointing out these sprites are actually from (or at least, were made before) the 20th anniversary. Guess that pretty much solidifies the fact they were created purely for merchandise (and no chance of weird new Mega Man games  :cry: )

I feel like we've come full circle!
Title: Re: New 8-bit Sprites on 25th Anniversary Albums??
Post by: MusashiAA on August 10, 2012, 04:16:42 AM
Not until we turn them into real sprites!
and we add them into the game
Title: Re: New 8-bit Sprites on 25th Anniversary Albums??
Post by: Geno on August 10, 2012, 11:21:20 AM
WHOA!

I'm gonna try to do the other ones now!

But all I can get is Elecman's face, and Airman's leg.  :(

EDIT: HEY!
I CAN DO WOODMAN NOW!
http://videogamemm.com/main/sites/defau ... to0797.jpg (http://videogamemm.com/main/sites/default/files/Photo0797.jpg)

And Gutsman and Iceman too!

EDIT2: Oh wait.
Too fuzzy.
 :evil:

Does anybody know of that higher quality image that Gauntlet supposedly has?
Title: Re: New 8-bit Sprites on 25th Anniversary Albums??
Post by: Karate Cat X on August 10, 2012, 05:56:58 PM
Well, I see people are having trouble with the jpeg-ed images of the new hurt sprites seen in the cover. Well, that can be fixed. I used IrfanView, it can decrease the colors to 16-bit.. and results will be something like this (note, also resized the image, but it's not blurred, or with bad quality no more).

(http://s9.postimage.org/pyryv8uvz/25th_Rockman_Hurt_Sprites.png) (http://postimage.org/)

Some do look messed up, but it's how close I could get the hurt poses in a decent quality.
Title: Re: New 8-bit Sprites on 25th Anniversary Albums??
Post by: Joseph Collins on August 10, 2012, 06:41:35 PM
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v341/JosephCollins/Sprites/R25A_HurtSprites.png)
(click to show/hide)
Welp, that killed about an hour.  I'm going to go have some lunch now.  Thanks.
Title: Re: New 8-bit Sprites on 25th Anniversary Albums??
Post by: PressStart on August 10, 2012, 08:49:17 PM
Lol, the Air Man one is awesome. And Metal Man does look p cool.

Great job, dudes!
Title: Re: New 8-bit Sprites on 25th Anniversary Albums??
Post by: ? Manibogi ? on August 10, 2012, 10:05:30 PM
So, are these sprites getting added to v3 or what? :mrgreen:
Title: Re: New 8-bit Sprites on 25th Anniversary Albums??
Post by: Kapus on August 11, 2012, 12:27:22 AM
We were discussing it earlier, and most people on the team seem to be in favor of keeping the original sprites.
Title: Re: New 8-bit Sprites on 25th Anniversary Albums??
Post by: MusashiAA on August 11, 2012, 12:47:02 AM
Quote from: "Kapus"
We were discussing it earlier, and most people on the team seem to be in favor of keeping the original sprites.

Of course they are :|
Title: Re: New 8-bit Sprites on 25th Anniversary Albums??
Post by: Geno on August 11, 2012, 01:06:09 AM
Now all we need to do, is Gutsman and Iceman!
http://videogamemm.com/main/sites/defau ... to0797.jpg (http://videogamemm.com/main/sites/default/files/Photo0797.jpg)
Title: Re: New 8-bit Sprites on 25th Anniversary Albums??
Post by: MusashiAA on August 11, 2012, 01:12:48 AM
Quote from: "geno"
Now all we need to do, is Gutsman and Iceman!
http://videogamemm.com/main/sites/defau ... to0797.jpg (http://videogamemm.com/main/sites/default/files/Photo0797.jpg)

You know... at this rate, I'm starting to believe that all RMs have a new hurt pose in at least one of these merch pieces...
Title: Re: New 8-bit Sprites on 25th Anniversary Albums??
Post by: Geno on August 11, 2012, 07:05:43 PM
Guess what?
Heeeeeeeeeeeeres Gutsy!
(http://cutstuff.net/molly/DBBKUP/gutsy.png)

I didn't have that program that other guy told us about, but what I did was I shrunk the pic of the 20th anniversary bracelet, turned it into a 256 colour BMP, plopped the low- quality Gutsman into another Paint window, took a MM1 Gutsman sprite, loaded the full size photo on another window, then got to work.
This is not 100% accurate, but It'll do until a better image appears, of someone with the bracelet remakes the sprites.
Title: Re: New 8-bit Sprites on 25th Anniversary Albums??
Post by: Davregis on August 12, 2012, 11:54:05 PM
What the heck is wrong with these sprites? They look incredibly odd.
Title: Re: New 8-bit Sprites on 25th Anniversary Albums??
Post by: LlamaHombre on August 13, 2012, 12:04:47 AM
They're made to look comical, Daveris. It's a light-hearted approach that a lot of people enjoy.
Title: Re: New 8-bit Sprites on 25th Anniversary Albums??
Post by: MusashiAA on August 13, 2012, 08:11:08 AM
I think he means that they're kinda smaller when compared to the original sprites

You know, like Hardman's? Or Gutsman's?

EDIT:

EUREKA!

(http://www.sprites-inc.co.uk/files/Classic/RMCW/Misc/rmcw_pocketstation_masters.png)

Isn't that Quickman sprite design familiar? How about that Hardman sprite design? Or that Flashman sprite design? Or that Crashman and the weird blackness?

Perhaps these "hurt" frames aren't new at all. In fact, they might even be from one of the Rockman Pocketstation games that were released for the Complete Works games back in 1999!!!! No wonder some of those sprites look different! The Pocketstation's resolution and overall color (only black and transparent/white) wasn't good enough to fit them entirely or permit more than two shades!

That explains why this Hardman's sprite design looks smaller compared to the MM3 one!

And why this Gutsman's hurt frame looks a wee smaller!!

And why this Quickman's sprite design is different from the original MM2 sprite design!!!

OH MY GOD, someone needs to hack the japanese Complete Works games (or the Pocketstation games) and find these sprites RIGHT NOW!
Title: Re: New 8-bit Sprites on 25th Anniversary Albums??
Post by: Kapus on August 13, 2012, 10:35:56 AM
I didn't even know that existed.
Title: Re: New 8-bit Sprites on 25th Anniversary Albums??
Post by: PressStart on August 14, 2012, 06:15:49 AM
lol wow, guess I spoke too soon about coming full circle!

First off, I gotta say, these sprites are pretty funky. Some of the choices of what parts they made black and white don't make much sense (white highlights were turned black??). While I like how goofy and original the hurt frames look, I don't blame people who do not want to use them for MM8BDM. Still, I think it's cool people are making colorized (and corrected) versions of them (and with all the sprite comics and fan games, they probably will get used in the future).

What's crazy is, that out of all the Mega Man sprites, the 20th and 25th anniversary items decided to use these. Sprites that are not only imperfect, but have limited choices considering some of these guys are missing body parts (I'm guessing Centaur Man isn't featured on any merchandise). I feel like I don't completely 'get' the Rockman Complete Works series either... it doesn't seem like it was released on any kind of anniversary for the series (1999, 12 years after Rockman came out in 1987). Are those sprites just more readily available to use, somehow? Maybe because they're in black and white?

Very strange stuff!

edit: Superhero DinnerSonic attempted to rip the sprites from the PocketStation games, but no go! As a consolation prize though, he got the save icon (which is the same for all the games except the number changes)
(http://i.imgur.com/vt75V.png)
Title: Re: New 8-bit Sprites on 25th Anniversary Albums??
Post by: Geno on August 14, 2012, 11:11:12 AM
Well, if someone finds hurt frames for ALL the MM1-6 Robot Masters, then It'll give me something to do for the next day or two.
Really, though, I can't see any height difference in Gutsman, it's really only Hard, Stone, Wind, and Blizzard that shrunk, everybody else just stayed the same, or got parts cut off them (Dive, Centaur, Bomb, Plant, Charge, etc.).
EDIT:
(http://cutstuff.net/molly/DBBKUP/gutspocketstationvsnes.png)

How would you rip from the Pocketstation? YY-CHR?
Title: Re: New 8-bit Sprites on 25th Anniversary Albums??
Post by: MusashiAA on August 14, 2012, 04:52:59 PM
I knew I should've explained this a bit more, but I wasn't exactly sure where to look:

We might not need to look on the Pocketstation. It's most likely that these sprites are inside the Complete Works re-releases. Why?

Long story short, I think all these frames were used in the most obscure feature of these re-releases: a pet training mode with multiplayer features, which was done through the Pocketstation. You see, the Pocketstation worked pretty much like a miniature Gameboy mixed up with a PS1 Memory Card. Some PS1 games could download data to a Pocketstation and viceversa, and these Pocketstations allowed multiplayer gaming through their infrared feature.

It is known that the japanese Complete Works re-releases features Pocketstation compatibility in the form of a training mode where you could earn EXP for an specific Robot Master from any classic MM game (included the player's) and make his in-game stats higher (more health, stronger attacks). Perhaps you could've downloaded your pet Robot Master into a Pocketstation and pit him against your friends' own pet Robot Masters in fights akin to what the Digimon Tamer games were at first.

Of course, each Robot Master would've need Pocketstation-friendly graphics for this, as well as new poses. In a game akin to Digimon Tamers, hurt frames (and as already shown on the 20th anniversary merchandise, attack frames) would make a lot of sense to have been created as a telltale for when your pet Robot Master was either damaged or defeated. Not only that, but the fact that it's a Pocketstation game would also explain why these sprite designs are slightly dumbed down versions of the NES sprite designs.

All in all, we would need to look on the Complete Works re-releases for higher chances of finding the remaining hurt frames.
Title: Re: New 8-bit Sprites on 25th Anniversary Albums??
Post by: Magnet Dood on August 14, 2012, 05:04:06 PM
That actually sounds pretty neat- It's like mini-duels between Robot Masters.

Even if certain parts were cut off, it doesn't look like they're a lot different from the NES sprites... You could probably do a bit of copypasta from the NES sprites onto the missing parts from here and take a stab at the colors- It is only black and white, after all.
Title: Re: New 8-bit Sprites on 25th Anniversary Albums??
Post by: LlamaHombre on August 14, 2012, 05:18:11 PM
(http://i1156.photobucket.com/albums/p565/LlamaHombre/bargh.png)

Now I can't vouch for what Flame Man's doing in that second sprite, but I know this is more oriented towards his Complete Works design.
Title: Re: New 8-bit Sprites on 25th Anniversary Albums??
Post by: Geno on August 14, 2012, 09:28:39 PM
I wonder if someone can contact a dude at Capcom and ask about the hurt frames?

@Musashi-COM: That "Pet Robot Master" thing sounds like fun!
Title: Re: New 8-bit Sprites on 25th Anniversary Albums??
Post by: Magnet Dood on August 14, 2012, 09:43:48 PM
Now that you mention it, a lot of these sprites are definitely based off of Complete Works... Wood Man's missing his grains and Hard Man is notably missing the rivets on either side of his chest, instead being replaced by that large green power gem.

Kind of weird now that I think of it- I've never heard of any mini games coming from that game anyway.
Title: Re: New 8-bit Sprites on 25th Anniversary Albums??
Post by: Geno on August 15, 2012, 11:08:09 AM
Quote from: "geno"
How would you rip from the Pocketstation?

Juuuuust wondering.
Title: Re: New 8-bit Sprites on 25th Anniversary Albums??
Post by: PressStart on August 15, 2012, 11:17:14 AM
Quote from: "geno"
Quote from: "geno"
How would you rip from the Pocketstation?

Juuuuust wondering.
Wish I knew. DSonic tried emulating, but the one he was using can't run the Rockman games. I have no knowledge on using tile-extracting software etc., so hopefully someone more knowledgeable can post a response (although it'd be pretty surprising for a PocketStation expert to be on Cutstuff).
Title: Re: New 8-bit Sprites on 25th Anniversary Albums??
Post by: Joseph Collins on August 16, 2012, 06:17:51 PM
Quote from: "Musashi-COM"
EUREKA!

http://www.sprites-inc.co.uk/files/Classic/RMCW/Misc/rmcw_pocketstation_masters.png

[...]

Perhaps these "hurt" frames aren't new at all. In fact, they might even be from one of the Rockman Pocketstation games that were released for the Complete Works games back in 1999!!!! No wonder some of those sprites look different! The Pocketstation's resolution and overall color (only black and transparent/white) wasn't good enough to fit them entirely or permit more than two shades!
The Japanese are laughing at us right now.
Title: Re: New 8-bit Sprites on 25th Anniversary Albums??
Post by: Geno on August 17, 2012, 01:17:53 PM
Quote from: "Joseph Collins"
The Japanese are laughing at us right now.
I think they knew people like us would go nuts over this kind of thing.