Saxton Hale was nerfed to half damage/no knockback (no knockback is a very rewarding power, especially for melee hales which are fast), but his rage lasts a bit longer to rebalance this. Your math starts getting wrong at the number of hits needed, as this actually varies, if the map has DOUBLEAMMO on or not... if it's not, this raises up to 125 hits. Soooo yea
Actually this is a factor of HUGE hax pretty much nobody knows about. Double Ammo doubles Curly's charge, Super Jump's charge, and the Rage as well. And, this was never noticed. I plan to fix the ammos next version so DoubleAmmo can't double/halve them :
Oh I'm fully aware that DOUBLEAMMO is the culprit. But knowing that doesn't change anything; my math is still accurate with regard to what you'll actually see in servers. Assuming that 125 hits are needed is what would have resulted in "wrong" calculations.
You also forgot to consider something, yeah of course Roll has 500 + 235*P health if she uses the rage, but... then her rage just allows her to have the same health as SH.
Bolded for your convenience:
Now, mind you, this is all assuming that the survivors are being fairly prudent in choosing their weapons. Seeing how close this puts Roll to Saxton Hale in overall resilience, that suggests to me that this would be reasonable if the survivors would (or could) do this every time. However, if they start using stuff like rippers, land numerous glancing blows with explosive weapons (Crash Bomb and Flash Bomb come to mind), or simply run out of ammo for their powerful weapons and switch to the buster, things start going downhill fast. And in my experience, that happens very often--not everyone is experienced enough to use the proper tactics against Roll, and the RNG is not always kind enough to provide a good powerful weapon to fight her with.
Then, Saxton Hale has 500+235*P health too... except he has his rage in addition to that, he doesn't need any healing rage to have this high health scaling.
Saxton Hale doesn't have a defensive mechanism that ruins your ability to damage him with weak rapid-fire weapons. Against him, 10 damage is 10 damage; you don't have to worry that he'll regain it all because you used the wrong weapon. And again, let me remind you that Saxton Hale's health is
high. The fact that Roll can have equivalent health even when the survivors are mostly limiting themselves to "strong" weapons is what makes her superior to him overall (not counting the broken range on her attack).
Like SH, Roll can't ragefeed when using the rage. Unlike SH, she still takes knockback. Way to go to FlashBomb her to death without carring about the actual ragefeeding as it doesn't feed.
Anyway, the rate at which the rage feeds (like with ripping, Crash Bomb or Flash Bomb) is another story, it concerns the hitstun amount.
A wonderful idea, except that Flash Bomb causes NO hit stun. (It used to, but then it was OP against almost every boss.) Also, she takes even less damage overall when the rage is active. 35% damage reduction > 25% healing. Any way you look at it, she's just far more difficult to kill than she should be.
The same would happen with any offensive hales. If you feed him, many Rocket punches will explode this day ==> overwhelming power. If you feed Roll, she'll cast a lot of healing ==> overwhelming defense.
Gilgamesh requires twice as much rage as Roll to perform a Rocket Punch. He's also much slower than other melee bosses and has shorter than average range on his normal attack (the same as Starman's). It makes him much more manageable overall.
But, the hitstuning, in my opinion, is a fighting way in SH : the more you hitstun, the more it feeds the rage... HOWEVER, the more you hitstun, the more powerful attacks like Hard Knuckles or Top Spin as well as most melee attacks like Slash Claw or Flame Sword are to strike, and in some cases, these "rape sessions" with hitstunning weapons can pretty much delete 1500 HP of a hale, and this last one being blocked by the hitstunning, they won't even be able to positionate correctly to use the rage.
To picture that, once I was Morshu in a server of ~10 players in Rebalanced, and I just got killed by a SINGLE Yamatoman who Yamatospinned me forever until I died. I could just, not move at all.
First, I should say that I agree that hit stun vs. low rage buildup is a good balance to encourage in the weaponry. (That's why I don't like the switch to damage-based rage buildup in Tails's Rebirth version.) The idea of a boss who is resistant to one of those two types of attack is interesting in theory, but it's resulted in a very boring rage, and in her current state, Roll is too unforgiving about it. And do remember that inescapable stun locks have become exceedingly rare in non-classes Saxton ever since Flash Bomb's hit stun capability was taken away. (In fact, I can't think of
any good way to completely paralyze the boss in the current version.)
PORoll being the only hale who has a rage dedicated to selfhealing, I'm not going to remove that gameplay, in that case I prefer to remove the whole hale ; I just don't want to modify the concept of one of the unique hales from Silversin's and leave her alone in that case.
In that case, I second Legtendga's motion to remove her entirely.
Mudkip's allies get a health nerf.
Then, spawning Torchic and Treecko frequently... no. Mudkip's health formula is like, 90 HP for each player ; he has 1000 HP when there are 10~12 players in game. Whereas most melees would easily have more than 2XXX. You can't make him able to rage often.
I'm just telling you what I've seen in the servers. Legtendga and the others aren't lying; Mudkip
can sometimes build up enough rage to summon its allies again immediately after they're finally killed off. Treecko's healing is not to be underestimated.
And speaking of Treecko, I should point out that there's a problematic glitch that can occur with it: Treecko can sometimes spawn
outside the map (or in a wall). If that happens, Treecko becomes an invulnerable source of healing, making it extremely difficult to finish off Mudkip. (It gets even worse if Torchic also spawns in an inaccessible area, constantly amplifying the healing.)
The idea between Flash Man and Dio Flash is the same. The scale of power isn't. You wouldn't expect a hale to have Flash Man's buster to kill all the survivors right
I wouldn't expect a good boss to have a cheap ability like Flash Man's at all, actually, let alone a ridiculously over-the-top version of it. >_>
Talking about Exit Unit, the dangerous situation is the same with Gilga and Rocket Punch, and no Exit Unit in your bag. If you find Gilga on your way as the last survivor, you have no chance to dodge it, the blast is too big and powerful to flee or resist, even an average player can't miss with this rage.
They do miss sometimes. Even I miss occasionally. Rocket Punch is very powerful, but the boss player still has to put a little effort into aiming it. Dio's rage requires absolutely no effort whatsoever--and you usually can't even survive it
with the Exit Unit.
The reason was simple, nostalgia (and tribute to Silversin's) but by "removing" I mean, "turning it off". She won't appear anymore ; the RNG couldn't select this hale. However, if the host (and obviously the players that want her), she could be forced for a round by the host. It's not fun dieing neither.
That sounds fine.
As long as you don't pick her very often.I would love to see you jumping or fleeing from rocket punch. Jumping won't help if you blast the punches to the ground, neither does running. When Gilga does the charging sound, you have less of a second to flee from the giant radius. They work like very fast Drill Bombs, you fire them on the victim's feets and they get hit by the blast.
Again, the boss player still has to aim. And if you have an Exit Unit, you can reliably avoid the attack.
You can dodge Dio's attack, and you can realise it better if you actually get in the situation of the hale.
When you're about to freeze time, there's a huge cooldown when you can't move. The players can notice it because the stand (cream flash man) is in an awkward sprite. Then, Dio gets slowed down when he's moving with the time frozen.
This all sounds great in theory, but in actual practice, it's not nearly enough time to get away--if you even notice what he's up to in the first place (and don't assume that he's just frozen because of lag).
Also, there's a small delay between the time unfreeze and the knives are chasing. The knives only hurt when they're moving. If you spam the item use button, you could use Exit Unit before all the knives pierce you.
Which is what most players do--myself included. So far, I've never pulled it off myself, and I can't recall seeing other players manage it either. If you have the Exit Unit, that means you're the only target for Dio--and that means he can concentrate on you and completely fill the air around you with knives. Some of them will inevitably end up at just the right range so that there's simply not enough time to warp away before they hit you, even when you're mashing the item key like mad.
In any other case, you must keep the biggest distance with the hale. Remember of the cooldown before the time get frozen (which might get increased even more if needed), and also try to hide in secret corners if some maps allows you to. You can eventually outrun Dio / get out of his sight.
Any non-idiot Dio player can force you into a position where you can't get away. Avoiding Flash Man's limited-range Time Stopper is hard enough--avoiding Dio's rage by any measure of your own skill (as opposed to boss idiocy or sheer luck) is just plain impossible.
I haven't tried Bitter End yet, I'll give it a spin now, but chances of being used are low if it's a "small" rage (which need 125 ammo, like most hales do. "Big" rages include Za Warudo or Rocket Punch, they need 250 ammo. Which version was Bitter End used in?)
Bitter End required the same amount of rage as Rocket Punch. (I actually used it in my last couple versions of Rebalanced Class Saxton Hale as Gilgamesh's rage on lower difficulties.) It's similar to Ballade's alt in YD Classes, only faster and with a much bigger boom. Most people seem to think it's more fair than Rocket Punch, and I'm inclined to agree.
Not really. He can't even travel half of MM8GRE while using the rage.
Again, you'd have to be an idiot to use the rage when no one is nearby. And bear in mind that some maps just aren't very good for hiding or escaping.
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