Regarding Our Community

[Orange juice :l]

@Smash
That's the same issue coming back again. It's much harder to interact in a Skype chat than it is on the forums or in an MM8BDM server. It's easy to meet someone in a DM server. It's not easy to meet someone when you need an invitation. The reason we had the Homie "pseudo-clan" wasn't entirely because they worshipped Slyfox so much. It was partially because they couldn't be accepted into a collective any other way.

[TheDoc]

I need to get me skype. I've heard people (from this community) say that MM8BDM is near-death. I dont agree. Sure, it used to be more popular, but its not going to die just yet. I've gone onto Doomseeker multiple times to see that the top server is a MM8BDM server. I see many people online everyday. People join this community as we speak, not to mention allthe players that don't join. Give MM8BDM a chance.

[King Dumb]

To me, the use of Skype in the community has extended far beyond MM8BDM. Aside from specific chats regarding MM8BDM projects (dev chats for CSCC RNC, etc.), I see Skype being used as a means for people who became friends through MM8BDM to maintain this friendship while playing other games. Hell, I'm not sure if most of the people in the 'main' chats even play MM8BDM anymore; I see groups of people running off to play TF2 more than I see people run off to play MM8BDM. Not that I disapprove of this; I personally am impressed by the level of tight-knit-ness (for a lack of better word) these folks have developed.

I agree with what you say, Shade. The issue arises when these chats that maintain these friends' friendships are meant to serve the double purpose as MM8BDM Cutstuff Community chats. I am aware that there exists a Team Fortress 2 chat; I'm even aware that nearly everyone in the main Cutstuff chat is in said chat. Th problem is that what is supposed to be, and what is advertised and generally regarded as, a Cutstuff Community chat, is actually not such a chat, regarding Cutstuff as the MM8BDM community.

People join this community as we speak, not to mention allthe players that don't join. Give MM8BDM a chance.

Firstly, the first sentence is a blatant untruth. Joining the community means becoming a part of it, and not only do I not see that happening on the forums, but to truly become integrated in today's Cutstuff you need to join Skype. Refer to the rest of the thread for discussion on that point.

"Give MM8BDM a chance"? MM8BDM has been passively given its "chance" for 9 months now. This is about removing the need for chance and calling for a need a for change.

[Rozark]

(click to show/hide)

Well, here's the somewhat related story of the hospitality of the community @ how I saw it. After about a year of being here, I believe only NOW I am getting some comfortability with everyone that I should've gotten many, many moons ago. For the longest time I mostly stayed to myself. I gained some familiarity, and decided one day to take up mapping, and I enjoyed it. I had Knux be my mentor/first feedback person for my maps, which gave me hope that I wasn't completely going to waste. Maps later,  I was then asked to join the 4MI chat. I hesitated because I knew what Skype could do, and that I really didn't want any chances. Well, after finding other reasons to get Skype, I took a chance. As for what groups I've been accepted in, I'm quite complacent/pleased with them. I see someone who's friendly, I'll usually request an add/vice versa. Then we get chat in servers themselves. Mostly it's just random stuff/all fun, but then THEY show up. The "Bik and Friends" appear and give me trouble for being a casual player and not being like them, but that's just me; I can't change my playstyle after a decade and quite frankly, I'm not going to become an asshole just for the hell of it. As said earlier, take awhile to learn someone before you just judge them on skill; you might just enjoy them.

It's also about time someone made this topic.

inb4 talk swerves to corrupted social classes of cutstuff with names
ANNNNNNNNNNNNNNND before CMM makes a comment.

[SmashTheEchidna]

I don't really know what to say to all of this, to be honest. I stopped using Skype a long time ago because I felt very uncomfortable and out of place in most of them. And as people constantly moved on, they eventually stopped adding me to new chats. So even if I do log into Skype, it's not like I can really do anything regarding this community. =/
I'm not even in the group that my brothers (literal and honorary alike) are all in.

[Gummywormz]

"Give people a chance, even if you previously judged their beings as the equivalent to bioprocessed human fecal matter." This is the trueriesit thing I've read in the whole topic. I've been wanting to become friends with people like daveris and stardroid venus and such, but I haven't had the oppurtunity to. Neither of them have been added here, I haven't been added to any chats with either of them. They were in the TF2 chat at one point, and it's easy to become friends with people with an easily accessible common interest, but they were booted out shortly after

Why don't you add them to the chats then? There are also more ways to contact them than through skype. Try to convince the others to give them second chances. You're letting the rest of the "elite" choose your friends.

[Davregis]

There's a cycle of repetitive human behavior through this. Give me a day.

[Ivory]

So after going on a walk and reviewing the topic, I'm ready to let my thoughts be known.

King Dumb, while you (and many others) have raised some good points, I can't say I fully agree with you.

1. You made a rather large opening post, but what I fail to see is any suggestions on how things could improve. What are you trying to accomplish by starting this topic without any specific goal to work towards? You simply called the entire nature of communication corrupt.

2. You (as I interpret it) also act as if I'm influenced by Roc's Chat (or any other chat I'm in). Yes, I'll listen to them on the matter, just as much as I would listen to any community matter that someone shares with me. But have I ever been a person to be easily swayed? No. I think after all my years on Cutstuff, that should be clear. I've never been someone to take 'sides'. I simply follow what I believe is right and strive to to act with good intentions. I'm not a hero, and I'm not a villain.

3. Skype has allowed the members of Cutstuff to grow closer and become friends. Something that isn't feasible on forums or in-game alone. It's convenient, it allows us to stay connected. But this isn't unique to Cutstuff, just about any forum, game, etc does something similar. It may not be skype in all cases, but don't people want to connect and find friendships with each other in an easy to manage way?

4. With the above said, It was obvious that the community split into may different groups, wasn't it? A feeling of belonging is something sought after by most people. You want to be around people you like, and agree with. With that being said, and proven by this thread itself, not everyone agrees with the other. Groups come into conflict for that reason mainly. Part of my job is to stay objective and meditate between the different sides. And I do trust that my global moderator staff would strive to do the same.

I've always been someone to give everyone a chance to prove themselves to me. I prefer seeing action over words. If someone proves to me that they changed, then I give them another chance. Likewise, you have to take action to change things King Dumb, you can't expect to simply make a thread have the problem fix itself.



Next is a comment on the only response I found to have no logical sense in at all.

but if i must say it, i find the decay in the community since the day Cutstuff needed to be moderated and kept in order, rather than it being a community where one would just hang out and be thrilled by the new updates.

Coming from a person who randomly posted things like single post "meow" in threads. What you failed to grasp is that behavior was never accepted to begin with. If Mike saw that, he would have warned and scolded you for it too. You only view it that way because I'm far more of a forum watch-dog than Mike was. If Cutstuff wasn't moderated, then the community would have fallen short ages ago. Trolls would be given full reign to what they please and arguments would breakout as a daily occurrence. You simply cannot expect the place to be lawless and not have it abused. That's why there are moderators such as myself to strive to keep the place orderly. --Just keep that in mind and remember, order has to exist to balance out the chaos.

[King Dumb]

1. You made a rather large opening post, but what I fail to see is any suggestions on how things could improve. What are you trying to accomplish by starting this topic without any specific goal to work towards? You simply called the entire nature of communication corrupt.

The original and only definite goal with the posting of this thread was to present as a wholistic issue the debilitating issues of the community. What I desire to produce is a community reaction, in whatever direction the community sees fit.

2. You (as I interpret it) also act as if I'm influenced by Roc's Chat (or any other chat I'm in). Yes, I'll listen to them on the matter, just as much as I would listen to any community matter that someone shares with me. But have I ever been a person to be easily swayed? No. I think after all my years on Cutstuff, that should be clear. I've never been someone to take 'sides'. I simply follow what I believe is right and strive to to act with good intentions. I'm not a hero, and I'm not a villain.

I believe it should be clear, as well. In fact, I counted on this very fact when posting this topic originally. I trust you to allow this discussion to take its course as long as it remains civil. If I had thought you were easily swayed by this collective, I would not have wasted my time with a discussion that would be quickly derailed, and had I gone ahead, a focus on corruption in the day-to-day administrator of this site would obviously have garnered more support. Regarding my question concerning you in my original post, in that regard I merely serve to provide the community with the whole truth, let each individual judge and speak for him/herself, and then my desire is that the community as a whole will come to a decision.

3. Skype has allowed the members of Cutstuff to grow closer and become friends. Something that isn't feasible on forums or in-game alone. It's convenient, it allows us to stay connected. But this isn't unique to Cutstuff, just about any forum, game, etc does something similar. It may not be skype in all cases, but don't people want to connect and find friendships with each other in an easy to manage way?

I agree with your statements here as well. The problem and the issues I describe are products of the specific circumstances of Skype usage in the Cutstuff community; that is to say, it is a combination of individuals, these individuals' interactions, AND the use of Skype as a medium that creates the problem. Regarding the creation and maintenance of friendships, refer to my response to Shade Guy's post.

4. With the above said, It was obvious that the community split into may different groups, wasn't it? A feeling of belonging is something sought after by most people. You want to be around people you like, and agree with. With that being said, and proven by this thread itself, not everyone agrees with the other. Groups come into conflict for that reason mainly. Part of my job is to stay objective and meditate between the different sides. And I do trust that my global moderator staff would strive to do the same.

Disagreement and argument are a part of every functioning community; they are akin to political parties in that not only are they inevitable, but their omnipresence makes them vital. When one group with a certain set of opinions completely dominates, other groups are repressed or oppressed. Once again, however, there is a key difference between competing opinions and the situation we have here, which is the inherent dominance of one group over the rest, the decadence of this dominance, and the negative effect it all has on the growth and development of the community.

Additionally, in the matters of this discussion, I also trust that moderators will act in an objective manner when it comes to moderation duties; I do not deem them, however, as restricted from expressing their opinions like the rest of us.

Likewise, you have to take action to change things King Dumb, you can't expect to simply make a thread have the problem fix itself.

The thread doesn't fix the problem, no. The thread presents the problem to the community at large. My first action is complete with the creation of this thread. There was nothing I could do alone to change an entire community until others had had an opportunity to form their opinions and speak out.

[Tesseractal]

Do you trust a head global moderator who associates constantly with this decadent group of social dominators, and to whom Roc’s Creation referred as a “feral dog” with one of the community’s most important platforms of interaction?

My original statement referred to all of the global moderators. All of them (past and present) have at one point or another gone "off the rails" and have to be put in line by Ivory. Remember when a dozen IPs were posted on the forums? Or when SmashBro was banned for a forum game post? I used this in defense of Llama before: I do trust Ivory. He isn't always right either, but he's light-years ahead of the other mods in terms of keeping it together. In the time I've seen them all of the mods have had to "fall back" on Ivory's own judgment when their own has failed. I trust Ivory because quite likely, he is the only one who can do that.

And that's why I think Ivory had a sort of reluctance with the mods he chose. I figure he looked for the attributes that were similar to him, but largely came up short in this community. My guess is that anyone he picked would basically just be like Korby. It'd be nice to have mods that were more like Ivory, but it'd also be impossible. That's why I think you have no solution for this problem: You don't like the administration, but you also don't like everyone else qualified because they're also friends. There isn't really much room for who can be a mod, but it isn't just about being mods - in things like this people always fall back on people they know. The "LA voiceover community is very close-knit" - referring to the majority of Skullgirls' VA being pulled from Squid Girl. There might BE a person who is more qualified to be a mod or admin... but none of us would know. Having a high degree of temperance / impartiality is important, but being able to expect it  is also important. I trust Llama to act in accordance with Ivory's wishes. The other reason you can't find a solution being...

Do you trust a group of individuals who avidly and viciously reject competition, experimentally shown to inject at least temporary life into a community that most will say is declining, with one of the community’s most important platforms of interaction?

No. Now, look closely: Which part of the community rejects competition? (I don't.) Is it really any single faction? The people who play on Hotel RP maps, who only play TF2 against each other - do they belong to one group? I think it's actually all of them, which is why your point doesn't really matter. Messatsu banned SR50; are him and the people on his servers part of the skype oligarchy? He made it physically impossible for anyone competitive to use his servers. (Unless I played the game without arrow keys, which is worthless.)  MM8BDM is primarily a multiplayer game, ergo it is dependent on the people who play it. The people who play it now bore me to tears. What are you going to do about that? Even if the people you don't like, the seven skype lords of decadence left or lost influence, would it really change anything? So what if you have a more friendlier skype chat? The reason this game has become anti-competitive is BECAUSE it's community-based. The people I enjoyed dueling were never a part of that chat. When I wanted to duel someone, I went to funcrusher. When I dueled Kombat, Rawk, -Ran, etc., I had fun. I never talked to any of them as part of a "community" - it doesn't matter. (Now I could duel five "community" members just to get OJ, who I then have to play on a garbage MM7 map. Pretty much 100% of the time. I get tired of Turbo Man and Spring Man showing up in map rotations.)

If you don't like the skype chats, start your own. See how far it gets. Since it's such a hot topic around here, I'll tell you why I made mine. I made two chats, Foxdie and Outer Haven. Foxdie was made to create a more concise community than the old, bloated Pirate Ship. Outer Haven was made because I don't trust Korby. Foxdie went beyond my control so I killed it. It's very unusual from how most people think, but I use a "less is more" mentality - I get more out of people the fewer of them I have. Although having a broader is a community is nice, having a close circle also allows for a "free-er" discussion - some people like to share their thoughts in private, I being one of them. You're in the chat; have you noticed the difference? How the people in this topic noted the "community chat" was "mostly spam and ADHD"? Why is that important to the community?  I find it kind of humorous what you label "decadence". If a group of people don't want Obelisk in their chat, why does removing him cause "decadence"? Skype I don't think has as much weight on this forum as you'd think.  You can get more people to play this game and to form their own communities. You won't get it just by complaining about a skype chat. When people pick up this game, they don't give a damn about what some buffoons in a pirate ship are saying - they care about the game itself. That's where the REAL 'decadence' lies. The people playing this game focus on the community, on playing their own mods. When a regular person like a homie sees all that garbage, it's off-putting. People who play this game for fun don't want to play CSCMR, or Saxton Hale, or Classes, but it's the "community" who continues to keep them going. The homies were the first to break the community cycle of "Play bad mods, complain about mods and play vanilla, make more bad mods" and were shoo-ed off by the xenophobic. Worrying about skype chats is the last thing you should worry about if you want to "promote community growth".

tl;dr version: All global moderators are dependent on Ivory, no matter who is chosen. People do not play this game because of skype chats, but because of having fun. People stop playing the game because of bad mods. If you play on Mess's servers or classes mods, you probably suck at this game. If you make skype chats more friendly or fair, you will still suck.

[Myroc]

Do you trust a head global moderator who associates constantly with this decadent group of social dominators, and to whom Roc’s Creation referred as a “feral dog” with one of the community’s most important platforms of interaction?

My original statement referred to all of the global moderators. All of them (past and present) have at one point or another gone "off the rails" and have to be put in line by Ivory. Remember when a dozen IPs were posted on the forums? Or when SmashBro was banned for a forum game post? I used this in defense of Llama before: I do trust Ivory. He isn't always right either, but he's light-years ahead of the other mods in terms of keeping it together. In the time I've seen them all of the mods have had to "fall back" on Ivory's own judgment when their own has failed. I trust Ivory because quite likely, he is the only one who can do that.

Allow me to go off on a tangent. Bear in mind that the moderators are all, shockingly, still only human. We all do mistakes. So far I think that the administration has had an excellent overall track record, I'm willing to let a single mistake slide as long as they realize it's a mistake. We can't judge everyone by every single act of decadence they had ever committed in the past, we need to be able to forgive, eventually.

Case in point: Tsukiyomaru0. At the time he was banned he was a major arse and possessed an ego whose size rivaled that of the universe himself. I don't think anyone missed him at that time. Now? He still remains rather secluded from the community, but the few times I see him on servers he is one of the most chill people I have ever seen. Hell he even helps a lot of fledging coders with DECORATE and ACS. I kind of feel like an arse myself for taunting him at the day he was banned. Like I said, we all do mistakes.

-----

Returning to the subject at hand, community splits like this are nothing new, nor unique to Cutstuff. Skype is only the means to how it happened regarding Cutstuff itself. I've seen it happen in other online communities as well. You thought this was the only community I was part of? I may be slightly less active in the others, but I can see similar trends that are comparable to our current situation. Community members becoming friends and forming groups is a change eventually happens in all communities. Whether or not it's a change for the better or for worse is up for debate.

[Max]

Maybe we could all play vanilla? Vanilla gets stale pretty fast.

Maybe we could all be in one chat? Just look at what happened to OJ's (now replaced) competitive chat.

Maybe we could all be friends? Problem is most of the 'HD Party' can be annoying to talk to for the 'Cool Kids'.

I don't know what point I'm trying to make here, perhaps it's that any sort of improvement is wishful thinking. I genuinely think there's no problem with the whole group split issue as long as ties between groups are kept relatively friendly. Short post, everything's been said already.

[King Dumb]

My original statement referred to all of the global moderators. All of them (past and present) have at one point or another gone "off the rails" and have to be put in line by Ivory. Remember when a dozen IPs were posted on the forums? Or when SmashBro was banned for a forum game post? I used this in defense of Llama before: I do trust Ivory. He isn't always right either, but he's light-years ahead of the other mods in terms of keeping it together. In the time I've seen them all of the mods have had to "fall back" on Ivory's own judgment when their own has failed. I trust Ivory because quite likely, he is the only one who can do that.

And that's why I think Ivory had a sort of reluctance with the mods he chose. I figure he looked for the attributes that were similar to him, but largely came up short in this community. My guess is that anyone he picked would basically just be like Korby. It'd be nice to have mods that were more like Ivory, but it'd also be impossible. That's why I think you have no solution for this problem: You don't like the administration, but you also don't like everyone else qualified because they're also friends. There isn't really much room for who can be a mod, but it isn't just about being mods - in things like this people always fall back on people they know. The "LA voiceover community is very close-knit" - referring to the majority of Skullgirls' VA being pulled from Squid Girl. There might BE a person who is more qualified to be a mod or admin... but none of us would know. Having a high degree of temperance / impartiality is important, but being able to expect it is also important. I trust Llama to act in accordance with Ivory's wishes.

Your statement in the New Global Moderators thread referred to all global moderators prior to LlamaHombre and Sora becoming such; this group is one person.

Otherwise, you seem to have quite largely missed my entire point. Perhaps you should dispel the preconceptions you had when you read the thread, you should read the original post (or maybe the entire thread) again. I do not doubt Ivory's ability to administrate (and moderate) capably and objectively. I thought I had made this clear. I don't imply or suppose he is unfit for his job, or that there are better candidates.

Cutstuff, do you trust a group of individuals who spend little to no time active on the forums and even less time experience the community in-game with one of the community’s most important platforms of interaction?

Do you trust a group of individuals who avidly and viciously reject competition, experimentally shown to inject at least temporary life into a community that most will say is declining, with one of the community’s most important platforms of interaction?

Do you trust a head global moderator who associates constantly with this decadent group of social dominators, and to whom Roc’s Creation referred as a “feral dog” with one of the community’s most important platforms of interaction?

Do you trust a newly-promoted admin who is surrounded – in an elite Skype chat where only the aforementioned select individuals and their closest friends are present – by the depraved, indifferent judgments these individuals pass on the community?

Do you trust a group of individuals who, in a medium where they cannot be punished and in the presence of the head global moderator speak these words after removing Obelisk from their “community chat”, with one of the community’s most important platforms of interaction?:

All of these circumstances exist - are directly caused by - because of the reality I proposed. These questions demonstrate the breadth of potential influence of the main subject, and in intent are meant nothing more than to be answered by the community. I supply the community at large with the reality of the situation, and what needs to happen for the betterment towards the community will become clear on its own. Questions I posed regarding moderators or Ivory are to be answered by the community, and by this I mean a large majority. We don't know what the majority thinks yet. We know what you think. I have already stated what I think.

Cutstuff is not a democracy. The people to whom I address my original post have no legitimate authority to enact change. However, Cutstuff is also not a nation; it is an online community. It is detestable and unintuitive that the way this community is run is not in the best interests of the majority.

Skype I don't think has as much weight on this forum as you'd think.

Really? The MM8BDM Skype Family thread tends to say otherwise. Many posts on this thread tend to say otherwise. The reaction in the very Skype chats of which I have spoken says otherwise. The constant, gradual death of the "homie" influx says otherwise. The absence of countless individuals that joined the forums in the past two months, but were ignored by the Skype-centric community or were ignorant of its existence, says otherwise. Many posts in this very thread, identifying how Skype has allowed friendships to grow stronger or how Skype has been a detriment to the community as a whole, say otherwise.

You can get more people to play this game and to form their own communities. You won't get it just by complaining about a skype chat.

No, I won't. You're right. I never implied this thread would fix the problem; I've already addressed that argument, because Ivory brought it up as well.

More people that have found MM8BDM have formed their communities; there has been an increase in Chilean servers and players in the past months. The homies had their own cluster of servers (though others could join). I don't have anything against these communities; I've very little interaction with the former and the latter I found quite pleasant. My point is these communities couldn't be integrated into the Cutstuff MM8BDM community even if they wanted to be. And if that's the case, they may as well not exist as far as the condition of the Cutstuff community is concerned.

The second half of your second-to-last paragraph is a somewhat different issue, as far as I understand. But perhaps someone will provide a connection.

[Turbodude]

Seeing as this storm has calmed down a bit, I'll put in my two cents if anybody wants to hear.
Kindly prove me wrong if I've misread anything, I'm avoiding hostility and I believe any in opposition should follow suit.

The way I see it, throughout this entire thread we have all made conclusions and pointed out various flaws, problems, and maybe even a few compliments here and there....
But where's our solution to this? We're all at impact here, and the way I see it there's no true way to please everyone.
Some people here want Cutstuff to strive by putting less dependance on Skype and more people discussing/playing what Cutstuff is made for, am I correct?  That can only last for so long, especially when 8BDM has yet to be updated. We've all played V2C front to back, we know all the twists and turns. MM8BDM's just like any other game, you play it day by day, or whatever period of time you prefer, and expect it to be equally as fun every time. That's like playing Brawl every day and having fun with it each time. Sure, it'll be fun for the first few days, but you'll feel less and less attracted to it, because it's the same crap different day.

Once this happens with 8BDM, people will most likely leave it for a while. and when people do that without dependance on Skype, valuable friendships that may have been made over the course of playing, will become distant or maybe even lost.
And who wants to lose friendships? I'm going to be brutally honest when I say this, but some people in this community have a harder time making friends in real life than on the internet, and some feel like their online friends are more important than their real ones. This is undeniable, but is that a bad thing? No. I used to be one of those people, but now's not the time for my Middle School/High School life story, this is about Cutstuff and Skype.

Some may argue that Skype is the source of controversy amongst similar users, and others pull the blame at those who reside on Skype. Admittedly I was feeling that way at first, but then something occurred to me...
Couldn't these controversies be equally as possible had everyone just stayed on Cutstuff? The way I see it, yes they can.
Let's face it, nobody can get along with everybody, there's always going to be someone who will have a beef with someone else, it's not a good thing, but it can't be helped. Because Skype is essentially where most communication outside of 8BDM talk takes place in, it's commonly referred to as the PROBLEM of things, when in actuality it's only the stage set for these outbursts. Look at the escapades of Lad and Lum, a lot of things involving them happened on MM8BDM itself, and not on Skype, they were ostracized from most people because of how people thought of their actions. I'm neutral on that scenario now, but it's a prime example that arguments and hostility can happen in any part of this community.

All in all, I feel that Skype isn't what should be blamed, and that it's a great tool for securing friendships with those who don't play 8BDM anymore, and let's face it, you can't keep playing the same game forever. *Hell, look at the SRB2 community, most people there hardly play the game but still communicate using their IRC chat.*
Secondly, If you see a problem rising, take a step back and look for a resolution, rather than trying to point fingers at someone or something.

[Gumballtoid]

For the most part, I agree with Turbo. I'm in a small Skype chat of about 14 or so. A good many of them are friends I've made over the year I've been on Cutstuff.

None of them have played MM8BDM in a good while.

If not for Skype, I'd probably not see those fellas for a good while, and eventually forget about them. But no. We've used Skype as a means to preserve friendships. Like Turbo said, some of us have a harder time making friends in their everyday life than they do online. I myself am one of those people. But having friends anywhere counts for something. We play TF2 together, we have Skype calls every-so-often, and I honestly can't remember a single day I haven't logged into Skype and struck up a conversation with someone.

However, there are a select group that have used Skype as a medium to stir up trouble amongst the quote-unquote "outcasts."

I'm going to make a throwback to about late February-early March, during that hellish shit-fest. I was playing on Shmeckie's classes server, going one-on-one with 75chris5, someone I'm sure you all know. I was minding my own business, tryin' to make the best of that time period, when all of a sudden, several individuals that make up a part of the group accused of being "corrupt" join the server and, seemingly for no reason, other than their disdain towards myself, call a vote kick against me. Everyone except 75chris5 and myself vote yes. Now what was I to do in that situation?

I couldn't do shit.

Hell, at the time, I didn't even know Skype existed. All I knew was that they were using something outside the game and outside the forums to organize it. It felt as if I wasn't welcome to play MM8BDM, even though I hadn't done a whole lot to anyone (or, at least, made an effort to).

I'm not saying Skype is a bad thing; it's not. It's helped me preserve friendships I would have lost ages ago. However, there are individuals that misuse it, which is a bad thing. And I'd put an arm and a leg on the fact that I'm not the only one who has suffered because of it.

All things considered, and correct me if I'm wrong, Skype isn't the problem. Those who misuse it are.