TMK4's Workshop (News regarding grad life and, oh, Saxton Hale too)

[The Killer Nacho]

Classes Saxton is the worst game mode. Period. It's so conceptually flawed that I can almost guarantee that no tweaking will make it nearly as fun as regular Hale. I'm starting to agree with Tails and hate classes in general. I would have more than happily tested the mod, but whatever, I guess. If you need someone for testing in general, I'll be more than happy, although you'd probably prefer someone that you've known for a while or something. If so, I understand.

[JaxOf7]

http://vssaxtonhale.wikia.com/wiki/Category:Bosses

?Bosses always move 10% faster than the slowest class alive.

Check me out, I just fixed Classes Saxton Hale.

[Linnie]

Is waiting for a quickman fun?

Not particularly.

Better yet; is waiting for a gyroman fun?

I wouldn't say that is that fun either, though to be honest I don't see people play Gyro that much anymore. Nor do I Quick. I think it's because they were both nerfed with v6g.

Is it fun to try and kill gyro or quick men?

Yes.

I find the cat-and-mouse chase to be fun when I'm the Hale.

Is it fun waiting 5 minutes DEAD while the hale tries to kill these gyro or quick men?

That sounds like a rather loaded question. Of course waiting isn't fun, but you're going to have to wait in no-fun-allowed Saxton too.

Also, people played the older version because the newer version had numerous bugs in it because those people don't know how to compile code efficiently.

Yeah, while I was in the Lego server, people tried to say "this version is better because it's compiled better." What does that even mean to someone who isn't involved in the development of the project? How does being compiled better make it more fun? Other than the occasional crash I've never had a problem with Hale, and I haven't even crashed in a good while.

People started playing the new version once PO Roll was removed, which personally I never had a problem with. Removing a hale instead of nerfing the healing? Why? That's just lazy.

I have to admit I liked the brokenness of PO'd Roll; this probably belongs in the funnies thread, but one round I got picked as PO'd Roll, and the rest of the server was in party mode -- they would all pick the same class each round -- and on that round it was Burstman, so half of them were Burstman. Immediately in the round they ambushed me and kept trapping me in their bubble, spacing their shots so I couldn't get out, and the rest of the players just went all out on me. My health started draining, but someone was using a rage-building attack, so I kept healing. Eventually my healing stacked high enough that, when I was at about 100-200 health, it started going up despite all the damage, and eventually I could keep spamming my rage despite being trapped and not die, and the game went into a deadlock. After about three minutes someone called a vote to change the map and end it, but it had to've been the funniest round of Hale I've ever participated in.

http://vssaxtonhale.wikia.com/wiki/Category:Bosses

?Bosses always move 10% faster than the slowest class alive.

Check me out, I just fixed Classes Saxton Hale.

Fund it! This is a great idea.

[Rozark]

I have to admit I liked the brokenness of PO'd Roll; this probably belongs in the funnies thread, but one round I got picked as PO'd Roll, and the rest of the server was in party mode -- they would all pick the same class each round -- and on that round it was Burstman, so half of them were Burstman. Immediately in the round they ambushed me and kept trapping me in their bubble, spacing their shots so I couldn't get out, and the rest of the players just went all out on me. My health started draining, but someone was using a rage-building attack, so I kept healing. Eventually my healing stacked high enough that, when I was at about 100-200 health, it started going up despite all the damage, and eventually I could keep spamming my rage despite being trapped and not die, and the game went into a deadlock. After about three minutes someone called a vote to change the map and end it, but it had to've been the funniest round of Hale I've ever participated in.

Because one of the contributing factors, if not only, to why PO Roll was removed was because of classes.
How about you add her back and nerf her, seeing as that was the case ^.
Tails, you already expressed how you don't like classes. If people decide to play classes with this, then they can deal with PO Roll. It's their fault for combining such mods together in the first place. You shouldn't have to remove or balance hales based on classes; it's the same reason you don't build maps for classes either.

[TailsMK4]

Because one of the contributing factors, if not only, to why PO Roll was removed was because of classes.
How about you add her back and nerf her, seeing as that was the case ^.

Rozark...I don't think you understood me at all.

If you would rather get her back in, then by all means try to convince the majority to join you. If you do so, I'll listen to your proposed changes. I leave matters like this to democracy. Hope you understand my stance on this.

Do what is underlined and I'll listen. Roll was removed because the community didn't want her back, nor did NeoDS. Now you are trying to make me come up with an excuse for removing her after I gave it out to a vote:

As for the hales themselves...the only ones that seem uncertain to me are Pissed Off Roll and NeoDS. Should we bring them back, but maybe work on them so they are a little more enjoyable, or just not bring them back at all?

On the other hand, I never liked PO Roll (even just as a character, without the overpowered healing ability) and would not be sorry if she didn't return.

I don't want PO'd Roll to come back,

I realize there were not that many votes, but if there were people that actually wanted her back, I am sure they would have said something. And btw...I never did Classes Saxton until just recently with MrL's version, so I had no idea Roll was effective against classes. I just do not like it when people assume things for my motives that are not true at all.

Rozark, all it takes is to find a way to make Roll more appealing to the community and she will be back in. I only removed her because the support for her returning was not that strong. This also goes for NeoDS. You should not be targeting me but rather the people that play Saxton Hale to come to your side. I will not add a hale back in that people currently hate, even if I personally wanted the hale back.

I'm only taking a hard stance because I want the best for the mod. If there ends up being overwhelming support for a former hale to return, then I will make all efforts to bring the hale back.

[The Killer Nacho]

Yes.

I find the cat-and-mouse chase to be fun when I'm the Hale.

. . .

The only issue is the Hale is a handicapped cat and the mouse is about as successful as Jerry is in beating Tom.

[ZeStopper]

Yes.

I find the cat-and-mouse chase to be fun when I'm the Hale.

. . .

The only issue is the Hale is a handicapped cat and the mouse is about as successful as Jerry is in beating Tom.

So what is the element of stalling with Gyro, Snake, Metal, Shadow, Quick, and maybe more?

[The Killer Nacho]

So what is the element of stalling with Gyro, Snake, Metal, Shadow, Quick, and maybe more?

I'm not completely sure I understand your question.

[fortegigasgospel]

Basicly he is asking how these classes stall the Hales.
Gyro can fly and is fast.
Quick is fast.
Snake and Metal can climb walls forever.
Shadow can become invisible.
Cloud and Shade can fly.
Drill can footlock himself up walls.
Just some examples.

[Linnie]

Well, that list isn't really true.

There's also Burst Man who can temporarily fly (yes I have had a Burst Man stall on me, with Wave Bikes too, that was really fun), Pharaoh Man who can hover, Gravity Man who in some maps can easily get away, Spring Man who can easily run away, Charge Man who can dash, Centy who can teleport, all the classes who can jump higher than normal,  etc.


Just playing devil's advocate.

. . .
The only issue is the Hale is a handicapped cat and the mouse is about as successful as Jerry is in beating Tom.

Well, if the player didn't stand a chance, how would that be any fun for the player? I don't see why players having as small advantage over Hale is a bad thing when in vanilla Saxton, the Hale has a large advantage. It's a nice alternative in tone, and the Hale still wins plenty of times.


As for Roll only being broken in classes, that wasn't my message at all. I was just pointing out how I've had fun with PO'd Roll. Yes, having a class was the reason for that infinite lock, but, an unbeatable scenario is just as likely to happen in vanilla if someone keeps using a rage-building weapon. I would like PO'd Roll to be back, but I'm not going to go aggressive on this topic because there have been times in which I found her to be annoying.

I've never played against NeoDS. Who are they?

[Korby]

Snake and Metal can climb walls forever.

What version of classes you playin', boy?

[Rozark]

There was once a user named Neo who made a self insert of himself as a hale. Basically, MMBN6 Boss music + OP Dash + High speed + melee. I believe the dash could be switched with an uppercut of sorts. If it wasn't for it being a self insert and how he reacted when we even DISCUSSED it, it would still be in today. You could always nerf/change a few things and call it Zero, or I'm missing something else on to why NeoDS was removed.

[The Killer Nacho]

Well, that list isn't really true.

Do you plan to elaborate on that?

. . .
The only issue is the Hale is a handicapped cat and the mouse is about as successful as Jerry is in beating Tom.

Well, if the player didn't stand a chance, how would that be any fun for the player? I don't see why players having as small advantage over Hale is a bad thing when in vanilla Saxton, the Hale has a large advantage. It's a nice alternative in tone, and the Hale still wins plenty of times.

The Hale most definitely does not have a large advantage. I guess you can argue that in R7, the Hales have too much health, but with enough people, the Hale is completely screwed. Even that argument is invalid, though, when you realize you're posting in TMK4's Workshop (the same one that gave birth to the Overhaul that has basically replaced R7 for now in normal Hale). In Overhaul, how does the Hale have an advantage at all? The survivor almost always gets 4-5 weapons and at least 1 is nearly always effective in a Hale match. Spreadrune makes some weapons downright ridiculous. If a Hale has a bad rage and the survivor has a weapon like Crash Bomb, Flash Bomb, Napalm Bomb, etc., the Hale is dead. Spreadrune Atomic Fire is just insane, not to mention stuff like Scorch Wheel that renders the Hale useless while it's active. Unless it's an extremely small server (which Classes Hale unfortunately never is), I simply disagree with your statement "the Hale wins plenty of times."

[Linnie]

By "isn't really true," I was joking; every point on the list is true, I was just adding more to the list. By not true, I meant incomplete.

And, I have indeed seen Hale servers only have 5-6 people.

[fortegigasgospel]

By "isn't really true," I was joking; every point on the list is true, I was just adding more to the list. By not true, I meant incomplete.

And, I have indeed seen Hale servers only have 5-6 people.

I did only say those were examples.

Snake and Metal can climb walls forever.

What version of classes you playin', boy?

As I play neither class I thought they could.  Point still is they can climb walls.